WStoreyII,
This is the type of problem that can be solved by walking through the code
with a debugger, sometimes you need to walk though the code a couple of
times...

Look carefully at this routine:

Public Class Deck

Private Cards As System.Collections.SortedList = New
System.Collections.SortedList(108)

Public ReadOnly Property Collection() As System.Collections.SortedList
Get
Return Collection
Collection = Cards
End Get
End Property

End Class

What does/is the first line of the Get doing?

What does/is the second line of the Get doing?

What should the (single) line of the Get be doing?

Remember that Functions & Property Get methods have a hidden variable that
acts as a return value.

Hope this helps
Jay

[quoted text, click to view]
when ever i run this code i get an error messager saying
Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Deck.Collection.Add(Index, Me)

but it is set to an instance in the collection property of the deck class

what am i doing wrong?

by the way this is my project for PHase 10 the card game just so that you
knw what you are looking at

WStoreyII

Dim MyDeck As Deck = New Deck
#Region " Cards "
' Phases
Public Phase() As String = {"Phases", Phase1, Phase2, Phase3, Phase4,
Phase5, Phase6, Phase7, Phase8, Phase9, Phase10}
Public Const Phase1 As String = " 2 sets of 3 "
Public Const Phase2 As String = " 1 set of 3 + 1 run of 4 "
Public Const Phase3 As String = " 1 set of 4 + 1 run of 4 "
Public Const Phase4 As String = " 1 run of 7 "
Public Const Phase5 As String = " 1 run of 8 "
Public Const Phase6 As String = " 1 run of 9 "
Public Const Phase7 As String = " 2 sets of 4 "
Public Const Phase8 As String = " 7 cards of one color "
Public Const Phase9 As String = " 1 set of 5 + 1 set of 2 "
Public Const Phase10 As String = " 1 set of 5 + 1 set of 3 "
'Red Cards 1 - 12
Public RCF1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 1, "1")
Public RCF2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 2, "2")
Public RCF3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 3, "3")
Public RCF4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 4, "4")
Public RCF5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 5, "5")
Public RCF6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 6, "6")
Public RCF7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 7, "7")
Public RCF8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 8, "8")
Public RCF9 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 9, "9")
Public RCF10 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 10, "10")
Public RCF11 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 11, "11")
Public RCF12 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 12, "12")
Public RCS1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 13, "1")
Public RCS2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 14, "2")
Public RCS3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 15, "3")
Public RCS4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 16, "4")
Public RCS5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 17, "5")
Public RCS6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 18, "6")
Public RCS7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 19, "7")
Public RCS8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 20, "8")
Public RCS9 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 21, "9")
Public RCS10 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 22, "10")
Public RCS11 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 23, "11")
Public RCS12 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 24, "12")
'Blue Cards 1 - 12
Public BCF1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 25, "1")
Public BCF2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 26, "2")
Public BCF3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 27, "3")
Public BCF4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 28, "4")
Public BCF5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 29, "5")
Public BCF6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 30, "6")
Public BCF7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 31, "7")
Public BCF8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 32, "8")
Public BCF9 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 33, "9")
Public BCF10 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 34, "10")
Public BCF11 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 35, "11")
Public BCF12 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 36, "12")
Public BCS1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 37, "1")
Public BCS2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 38, "2")
Public BCS3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 39, "3")
Public BCS4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 40, "4")
Public BCS5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 41, "5")
Public BCS6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 42, "6")
Public BCS7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 43, "7")
Public BCS8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 44, "8")
Public BCS9 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 45, "9")
Public BCS10 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 46, "10")
Public BCS11 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 47, "11")
Public BCS12 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 48, "12")
'Green Cards 1 - 12
Public GCF1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 49, "1")
Public GCF2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 50, "2")
Public GCF3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 51, "3")
Public GCF4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 52, "4")
Public GCF5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 53, "5")
Public GCF6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 54, "6")
Public GCF7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 55, "7")
Public GCF8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 56, "8")
Public GCF9 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 57, "9")
Public GCF10 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 58, "10")
Public GCF11 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 59, "11")
Public GCF12 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 60, "12")
Public GCS1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 61, "1")
Public GCS2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 62, "2")
Public GCS3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 63, "3")
Public GCS4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 64, "4")
Public GCS5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 65, "5")
Public GCS6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 66, "6")
Public GCS7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 67, "7")
Public GCS8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 68, "8")
Public GCS9 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 69, "9")
Public GCS10 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 70, "10")
Public GCS11 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 71, "11")
Public GCS12 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 72, "12")
'Yellow Cards 1 - 12
Public YCF1 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 73, "1")
Public YCF2 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 74, "2")
Public YCF3 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 75, "3")
Public YCF4 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 76, "4")
Public YCF5 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 77, "5")
Public YCF6 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 78, "6")
Public YCF7 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 79, "7")
Public YCF8 As Card = New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 80, "8")

"Jay B. Harlow [MVP - Outlook]" <Jay_Harlow_MVP@msn.com> wrote...
[quoted text, click to view]

It can? :-)

Mr. Storey... perhaps you think I'm a dope or something and in that case
I'll just steer around your messages but do understand that I'm attempting
to be helpful. If you plan things out first the process will go faster, the
code will look cleaner, the program will run better and you will be a better
programmer for having understood the process.

Let me just leave it at that for now. I wrote the shuffle routine in VB.Net
if you would like that posted...

Tom

when ever i run this code i get an error messager saying=20
Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Deck.Collection.Add(Index, Me)

but it is set to an instance in the collection property of the deck =
class=20

what am i doing wrong?

by the way this is my project for PHase 10 the card game just so that =
you knw what you are looking at=20

WStoreyII

Dim MyDeck As Deck =3D New Deck
#Region " Cards "
' Phases=20
Public Phase() As String =3D {"Phases", Phase1, Phase2, Phase3, Phase4, =
Phase5, Phase6, Phase7, Phase8, Phase9, Phase10}
Public Const Phase1 As String =3D " 2 sets of 3 "
Public Const Phase2 As String =3D " 1 set of 3 + 1 run of 4 "
Public Const Phase3 As String =3D " 1 set of 4 + 1 run of 4 "
Public Const Phase4 As String =3D " 1 run of 7 "
Public Const Phase5 As String =3D " 1 run of 8 "
Public Const Phase6 As String =3D " 1 run of 9 "
Public Const Phase7 As String =3D " 2 sets of 4 "
Public Const Phase8 As String =3D " 7 cards of one color "
Public Const Phase9 As String =3D " 1 set of 5 + 1 set of 2 "
Public Const Phase10 As String =3D " 1 set of 5 + 1 set of 3 "
'Red Cards 1 - 12=20
Public RCF1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 1, "1")
Public RCF2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 2, "2")
Public RCF3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 3, "3")
Public RCF4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 4, "4")
Public RCF5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 5, "5")
Public RCF6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 6, "6")
Public RCF7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 7, "7")
Public RCF8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 8, "8")
Public RCF9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 9, "9")
Public RCF10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 10, "10")
Public RCF11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 11, "11")
Public RCF12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 12, "12")
Public RCS1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 13, "1")
Public RCS2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 14, "2")
Public RCS3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 15, "3")
Public RCS4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 16, "4")
Public RCS5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 17, "5")
Public RCS6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 18, "6")
Public RCS7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 19, "7")
Public RCS8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 20, "8")
Public RCS9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 5, 21, "9")
Public RCS10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 22, "10")
Public RCS11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 23, "11")
Public RCS12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Red", 10, 24, "12")
'Blue Cards 1 - 12=20
Public BCF1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 25, "1")
Public BCF2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 26, "2")
Public BCF3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 27, "3")
Public BCF4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 28, "4")
Public BCF5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 29, "5")
Public BCF6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 30, "6")
Public BCF7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 31, "7")
Public BCF8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 32, "8")
Public BCF9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 33, "9")
Public BCF10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 34, "10")
Public BCF11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 35, "11")
Public BCF12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 36, "12")
Public BCS1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 37, "1")
Public BCS2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 38, "2")
Public BCS3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 39, "3")
Public BCS4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 40, "4")
Public BCS5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 41, "5")
Public BCS6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 42, "6")
Public BCS7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 43, "7")
Public BCS8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 44, "8")
Public BCS9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 5, 45, "9")
Public BCS10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 46, "10")
Public BCS11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 47, "11")
Public BCS12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Blue", 10, 48, "12")
'Green Cards 1 - 12=20
Public GCF1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 49, "1")
Public GCF2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 50, "2")
Public GCF3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 51, "3")
Public GCF4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 52, "4")
Public GCF5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 53, "5")
Public GCF6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 54, "6")
Public GCF7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 55, "7")
Public GCF8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 56, "8")
Public GCF9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 57, "9")
Public GCF10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 58, "10")
Public GCF11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 59, "11")
Public GCF12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 60, "12")
Public GCS1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 61, "1")
Public GCS2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 62, "2")
Public GCS3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 63, "3")
Public GCS4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 64, "4")
Public GCS5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 65, "5")
Public GCS6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 66, "6")
Public GCS7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 67, "7")
Public GCS8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 68, "8")
Public GCS9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 5, 69, "9")
Public GCS10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 70, "10")
Public GCS11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 71, "11")
Public GCS12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Green", 10, 72, "12")
'Yellow Cards 1 - 12=20
Public YCF1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 73, "1")
Public YCF2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 74, "2")
Public YCF3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 75, "3")
Public YCF4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 76, "4")
Public YCF5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 77, "5")
Public YCF6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 78, "6")
Public YCF7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 79, "7")
Public YCF8 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 80, "8")
Public YCF9 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 81, "9")
Public YCF10 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 10, 82, "10")
Public YCF11 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 10, 83, "11")
Public YCF12 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 10, 84, "12")
Public YCS1 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 85, "1")
Public YCS2 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 86, "2")
Public YCS3 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 87, "3")
Public YCS4 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 88, "4")
Public YCS5 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 89, "5")
Public YCS6 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 90, "6")
Public YCS7 As Card =3D New Card(MyDeck, "Yellow", 5, 91, "7")

Tom,
[quoted text, click to view]

Yes!

Especially when I gave him the routine that has the problem, and I hopefully
gave him four very good clues on what the problem is.

If you single step the routine I identified watching all the variables that
I had questions on, when it occurs to you what the problem is, it should hit
you like a ton of bricks.

Also I hope you will have a new found appriciation for distaining the hidden
variable on Property Get & Functions. Yes it bit me the other day on
something on a contract position.

Granted if you are seeing other problems (other then the NullReference) then
you are welcome to identify those, I was only referring to the NullReference
Mr Story asked about.

Hope this helps
Jay


[quoted text, click to view]

"Jay B. Harlow [MVP - Outlook]" <Jay_Harlow_MVP@msn.com> wrote...
[quoted text, click to view]

Hi Jay... it was an attempt at a joke since you mentioned "this type of
problem" and I saw perhaps a dozen problems. I get the sense that the OP
wants to solve the "fatal bug" rather than discuss the solution however.
That's not unusual per se but it often means there will be a series of "now
it's doing this" and "how do I get it to stop doing that" questions
following on shortly.

Many of the problems people encounter wouldn't exist if they considered a
different tack through the rocky shoals.

[quoted text, click to view]

I try not to sound rude but it is often almost impossible not to seem rude
when one "challenges" people's code, if you know what I mean.

One way of knowing if you are on the right track (or let's say a "good"
track) is if you can describe your solution "before" you start writing it.
You are writing a card game so a "deck" class seems likely and a "card"
class seems obvious. And we know there will be rules and something has to
paint the cards, etc.

So check the solution you posted. You have a card class that inherits from
SystemWindows.Forms.Label. Generally speaking what would a playing card
have in common with a label? What is it in the label that you find so
card-like that you consider this a step towards developing your card class?
Does the question cause you to pause and ask yourself, uhhh yes what was I
thinking? Or is your reaction "you don't understand I need to display the
cards, blah, blah"? It may not seem like it but I do understand that you
need to display the cards. I also understand that you might like them to be
displayed in a picturebox one day.

Now consider how you place cards into the deck. You pass a deck object to a
card constructor. The card object references the internal collection of the
deck. You pass (among other things) an incrementing index number. Pass the
wrong number and things get messed up. You're passing a text string
representing a color which the constructor immediately turns back into an
actual color. If you pass "Green" in English you have to write code to
convert it, you run the risk of typing it wrong and you have to add more
case statements to support "Cyan" or "Magenta" if you pass along a color
none of these restrictions exist.

Consider that a deck of cards is (for most purposes) a "datasource" no
different than any other data source one might use in an application. If
you look at the way datasources are handled in .Net you will see that
"binding" them to controls is a useful practice. This suggests that you
should not derive a Card class from a label but that you should create a
deck class that maintains and services a collection of card objects. The
deck should probably have a AddCard method. It can then have a DeleteCard,
a Shuffle, a Draw and whatever deck-related things you need. And if you
select databinding as a methodology you can bind your deck and cards to
various controls (or none at all.)

My point is just that the more "unlike" a deck of cards your deck/card
classes are the more likely you will run into trouble. If you did nothing
else couldn't the deck constructor add all your cards for you? Why would
the form need to construct the only deck of cards it will ever need every
time? I realize you don't need it but how nice if you could simply write
something along the lines of:

Dim Deck1 as Deck = New Deck
Dim Deck2 as Deck = New Deck

and you would have two decks... the way you have it written you have to have
the form add 108 cards into the each of the decks.

In any case... I'm not suggesting I know all the answers but I am suggesting
you are (seemingly) making the project more difficult than it needs to be.

I hope this helps.
Tom

yes jay and i thank you it did work

and i did trouble shoot the code but i still miss things

WStoreyII

Thanks for all the help

[quoted text, click to view]

hey im open to any suggestions that you have
i am still new and with my limited vb.net or programming knowledge this
seemed to be the best way about going to building this game

WStoreyII



[quoted text, click to view]

[quoted text, click to view]

This is just an FYI, but in the \windows\system32\ folder (on WinXP) there
is a cards.dll that has all the card images. I believe that you can use
that with your game. Also, at www.gotdotnet.com, there is an example of
how to get the images from the .dll.

--
Chris

To send me an E-mail, remove the underscores and lunchmeat from my E-Mail

"WStoreyII" <papastoreyii@sbcglobal.net> wrote...

[quoted text, click to view]
sucked.
Let's call it "sub-optimal" :-)

[quoted text, click to view]
Want another time-saving hint? Don't scan the cards tonight... your project
isn't "nearly complete except for the card images" and we know that you can
operate the scanner. These are delay tactics that people (including
programmers) use all the time. You'll get so caught up in fixing some
graphics that the program won't get written. And you can always fancy it up
later.

[quoted text, click to view]

I'm not too worried about memory, we can always buy more and it is
virtualized in Windows in any case. If you needed to maintain reference
pointers to every card in the deck then by all means set them up. I'll
guess that you don't need it. Using memory is one thing, wasting memory
(and your time wasting that memory) is another.

[quoted text, click to view]

I'm glad you feel that way, messages aren't the perfect communication device
but it will have to do. As for crawling, consider completing each "part" of
the game instead of the entire card game. Write a Deck class and a Card
class and simply play with them for awhile. No positions on the screen, no
graphics, nothing unrelated to the Deck and the Cards. Have it output the
values using Console.WriteLine. Make sure that you can add a card, delete a
card, traverse the deck reporting the value of each card, shuffle the deck,
report how many cards remain in the deck, etc. Do you need a discard pile?
Do you need a player's Hand class to hold a set of cards?

At some point later on you will have most of it working and you can add the
graphics. When you do you can decide if the application maintains this (is
it part of the GUI?) or are the images somehow associated with either the
Deck Class or the Cards themselves.

Surprisingly, if you take your time you will actually finish it faster.

Tom

Tom ,

Thank you for all that advice, yes my original approach to the game sucked.
I do not have a lot of scope right now as to what vb.net or any programing
language is capable of. I have started to reorganize the project i am
making flow charts and stuff. And i am going to scan the cards tonigth and
add them to an image list. I agree with you idea about a deck class and
card class, this is what i came up with last night when designing it and
some posted to make my own card collection class that derives from
collection base and i am going to give that a try to. I see you point
though that its easier (on memory to i presume) to create instances of the
cards and decks instead of creating it all. dont feel afraid of sounding
rude that is the point. I asked you to tell me what was wrong, you tell me
what you think i make any neccesary changes i feel like. if i dont take
your advice its my fault there is no rudeness invovled in that and i thank
you for your honesty and your help as well as your patience with a newbie
who wishes to run before he crawls

WStoreyII

[quoted text, click to view]