macromedia flash flash remoting: Hi,

We are starting a project that involves making a Flash file communicate with
a .NET Web Service. We first have had a look at Flash Remoting and found out
that it was quite limited. DataSets seem to pose quite a lot of problems
here. Security seems to be another big problem.

We've then found Flash ORB which seems to be a subsitution for Flash
Remoting: http://www.flashorb.com/

According to their web site, Flash ORB:
- is fully compatible with Flash and Flash Remoting
- can do all that Flash Remoting does and more
- is free (well, this is not really clear on their web site actually) while
Flash Remoting costs $1000

Can anybody explain me that? The Flash ORB web site is quite confusing. How
can Macromedia ask $1000 for Flash Remoting if a competitor offers something
better and fully compatible for free??? There must be something wrong with
Flash ORB. Or have i missed something?

Thanks

You are not missing anything!
I have become extremely frustrated with flash remoting and we eventually had
to change to OpenAMF. I cannot speak for FlashORB but try it and share your
experience.

I do not have a problem spending $1000 for a product but what MM did is just
arrogant:
- No commitment to cintinue product. For a whie it was not supported im MX2004
- No support

then again, the remoting concept was MMs idea and it is really clever and
works well. But that alone is not enough.

Hi,

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Thanks for your answer. If we finally choose FlashORB, i'll report the
success (or failure :-) of the project here.

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I don't either (well, the money is not coming from my pocket anyway :-) but
i'm brand new to Flash and Flash Remoting and i have to make a choice right
now about the tools we are going to use for this project (because if we have
to buy something, it has to be bought now). And i am really confused to see
that
- on one side, Macromedia sells $1000 a product that seems to be heavily
critisized on major points such as DataSet managment and security
- on the other side, an unknown (to me) company claims that they have a
better, yet fully compatible, product that replaces Flash Remoting and that
they are offering it for free!

I just don't get it. Why would people spend $1000 on a product if they can
have better for free? This puzzles me, really. And the lack of clear
articles and comparison on the Web doesn't help. I hope that somebody will
be able to explain me that.

Wow, I'd really like to know what program you ended up using and why...

I tried deploying OPENAMF and still to this day, 1 month later, I still can't
find documentation that fully explains how to install and configure it... Nor
have I found any tutorials on it...

Care to share this info? Anyone...

I have tried flashorb and it works just as well as Flash Remoting. FlashOrb is
free for commercial use but they also offer a $600 version that includes
support and a Flash GUI for security and configuration. The free version comes
with no support so that is a trade-off. I thought about OpenAMF but the
documentation is non-existent. I have simply installed the .jar file and
changed the gateway address in my actionscript code in my former flash-remoting
projects and everything seems to work fine.

It depends on which FlashOrb installation you choose.

I can only speak to the .Net implementation:

As far as security is concerned, here's a quote directly from the website::

Security ? Exposing server-side components without any security measures makes
your server vulnerable for attacks and could have dangerous consequences.
FlashORB provides rich, multi-tier security system. FlashORB server can be
configured with multiple security levels ranging from global server-wide
permissions to more granular i.e. method-level access properties. FlashORB
implements multiple security methods and integrates with standard security
domains like LDAP or Windows NT.

The beautiful thing about flashorb is that you I can call .Net assemblies
directly as if I was writing the entire app in .Net - Flashorb handles ALL of
the serialization automatically!!

One note about the "FREE" version is that it only works in developer mode -
that is, it will only process requests from the first IP that accesses it.

I have been very please with the flexibility and ease of use with Flashorb so
far and highty recommend it.

Just to expand on what PixelPuppet said:

"One note about the "FREE" version is that it only works in developer mode -
that is, it will only process requests from the first IP that accesses it."

I don't know about .NET, but I use the free standard edition Java
implementation and it works from other ip addresses. You register for the free
version with the company and they email you a license key which allows you to
use FlashOrb for any projects.

As for security with FlashOrb, I'm guessing you can configure security on the
free edition if you know how to tweak all the xml files. The point of the pro
version is that it provides a GUI for easy config. I

I should have clarified usage for the .NET implementation:

Unfortunately, there is no Standard version for .NET - it's only available in
Pro, hence the developer mode for .NET

I don't know why the Java edition gets both a standard and pro where as .NET
does not.

Thanks -

FlashORB implements multiple security methods and integrates with standard
security domains like LDAP or Windows NT.

Hell yeah! LDAP is what I'm working with, not that I like Novell & LDAP, but
if FlashORB works with it's all for the better...

I've downloaded the Free Java platform and got my key, I'll test it some
tomorrow...

Maliko50, are you using LDAP on yours? Free or Full version?

Hi guys,

While in the general most of the statements are correct, I noticed several
misunderstandings here. Let me try to clarify some:

- there's no free version of FlashORB.Net. You get a free development license
(i.e you do not need to purchase it), BUT a license MUST be obtained for
testing and production purposes. The 'development mode' is there to support the
'no-charge' statement for development. Deploying FlashORB.Net into a production
environment without a license is illegal
and not very practical as the product will process requests only from 1 IP
address. On top of that the requests are processed in a single threaded mode -
FlashORB in dev. mode throttles multiple requests.

- the Java version does have a free version (FlashORB Standard). The Standard
license agreement outlines the terms and conditions for the usage of the
product: http://www.flashorb.com/standardlicense.shtml

- Standard edition contains a minimum set of features (very similar feature
set as what you would find with Flash Remoting MX). It does not have any
support for security, message server, pluggable serializers, management
console, etc). See full comparison chart between Standard and Professional
edition here: http://www.flashorb.com/aboutflashorb.shtml

Hope this helps.

Joe
-----------------------------------------
Joe Orbman, Chief Architect
Midnight Coders, LLC
FlashORB - The New Way of Flash Remoting
blog: http://dev.flashorb.com/blog

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Thanks for the clarifications. I originaly started this thread to know if it
FlashORB was worth it compared to Flash Remoting. My main concern was the
ability to call .NET Web Service methods taking .NET Datasets in parameters
and returning Datasets. This is actually a very common use of Web Services
(at least in the .NET world) but it seems that Flash Remoting doesn't handle
that well (or even not at all).

There is no mention of Dataset support on your web site so here is my
question: can FlashORB be used to work with .NET Web Services that use
Datasets?

flashorbman,

Maybe you can give us some more insight into the Java version. Mainly or well
my biggest questions... I work on a Novell system running Apache & Tomcat,
would FlashORB run without incedent on this set up? The reason I ask is
Remoting MX is only for Windows and Linux.

If you have more details on the security please do share that too.